Very sorry to hear about the accident involving Ohmasa's and the death of his co-worker. I have a very small HHO generator and during my research relating to flashback and backfire arrestors, I stumbled on a comment on youtube (unfortunately I can't find it now but I remember it was on a video from this channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZOPMqpMIcEloSwqleQcfeA). They were talking about systems to generate deuterium depleted water through burning browns gas and capturing the liquid. I would argue they are getting much more than just deuterium depleted water probably and don't even know it. Anyways the comment that caught my eye was warning about backfire arrestors and one person was saying to use 2 arrestors to be extra safe, and another person chimed in saying to be very careful doing it as he'de had 7 (yes seven) backfire arrestors in series and they had ALL failed at the same time. This brings me to your remark where you said something along the lines of "people always say it's a hydrogen explosion, but much more is taking place here" This would be in keeping with what I've read as you would expect if the probability of a single backflow arrestor failing due to explosion was relatively low, it would be very unlikely that SEVEN would faill at the same time, unless the effect was something else (an EVO shooting back up the gas line to ground through the generator perhaps?)
Also sorry for my lack of updates recently, my friend said he would record a vocal for the song but we haven't had time to do it yet as he's been busy. Also I did try the experiment with 0.2mm thick lead foil in a sealed plastic bag but it was not so successful. I tried stick 0.2mm adhesive lead foil onto aluminum foil and that appeared to generator afew tiny holes in the aluminum side but I haven't had a chance to put it under a microscope yet. It did give me an idea though based on space earth human which I may or may not try. Taking an adhesive backed lead foil and cutting it into say 20 squares and layering them on top of one another. We know that EVO's like to form in crevices, and we also know from space earth human that diffraction gratings can slow them down (at least I think that's what I remember reading). It seems like it might be a good way to build a kind of safe zone the evo might be more likely to stay in (without needing to make a full on nested set of boxes like a full on orgone accumulator type thing.
Lastly just a word of caution about drinking HHO infused water from an annecdotal experience :) I tried this recently for a health issue I was having and it seemed to work I think however it's hard to know. Anyways I had some issues when I mixed the HHO infused water with coconut water and consumed it, it was like I instantaneously got dizzy, quite amazing. I have a good friend who's been a homeopath for 30 years and talked to her because I wanted to know what the symptoms for the proving of coconuts involved. and the symptoms exhibited by the people sounded to match what I've been feeling the last few days. Anyways I realize it's annecdotal and entirely speculative but I'm left with the suspicion that the EVO's in the water picked up the energy from the coconut water, then gave me the equivalent of a hyper homeopathic dose of coconut water. Needless to say I've headed my friends recommendation and won't be consuming HHO water any more (especially not after mixing it with anything) ;)
Hey Bob, Sorry I apologize I misremembered this, it was 5 arrestors of which 3 failed (I should have searched for the comment before remarking), I wrote a script to search all the comments on all the videos in that youtube channel and tracked down the actual comment I was misremembering.
The relevant portion of the comment was " I installed 5 safety systems to catch and arrest any such occurrence; however, in one such occurrence 3 of the 5 safeties failed/were defeated by the explosion. In short, not something I was willing to contend with further on a commercial level with 100s of L/minute of HHO gas. "
So I guess adding lots of backflow arrestors may be an option. Anyways it would seem that 3 isn't enough possibly.
The full comment is below for context (don't bother reading it though).
"Aquarion H2O
Aquarion H2O
5 months ago
@delvis11 The initial proof of convent for reducing HHO back into drinking water was disassembled about 2 years ago. I’m in process of completing my 3rd generation system now, with 5 generations of systems already designed.
The big benefit to the “new water” generation is the stripping out of Deuterium (heavy hydrogen isotope) from the water, which leaves you new “drinking water” that has many health benefits once processed for drinking.
The biggest downside of the reduction process from HHO to drinking water is the hydrogen bomb sitting there if/when your torch goes out.🥴. In my proof of concept system, I installed 5 safety systems to catch and arrest any such occurrence; however, in one such occurrence 3 of the 5 safeties failed/were defeated by the explosion. In short, not something I was willing to contend with further on a commercial level with 100s of L/minute of HHO gas. Any failure on that scale would be very very damaging & life-threatening....So, my advice, if you want to keep a system of this nature for your own personal use, over engineer your safeties & use a catalytic converter instead of a torch for your reduction phase. Ideally, also use PEMs so you don’t need to use electrolyte (because these add contaminants to the system which lead to other unwanted issues).
I think the grounding of the flame arrestors is a great idea but also use a bubble chamber type arrestor in series to the traditional type of porous metal arrestors for added safety. This stuff is deadly and very unforgiving of lapses in attention to safety.
Not sure what is commercially available for high flow rates. I would imagine you would need to design and fabricate something based on the flow rate and pressure but with a burst disc in case the down stream arrestors failed. It will introduce a pressure drop as well that would have to be calculated into the system performance. I would suggest testing a scaled down version first then moving up or adding small modules in parallel to increase the flow rate as the bubble elements in these chamber type arrestors probably don't scale well and have a maximum safe flow rate before the bubbles become a stream.
What is the order of flow rate and pressure for this BN 2000?
I was only using a small gas generator with low pressures and flow rate when I built the "water bong" type secondary arrestor for my system years ago. The concept is simple but I always go with smaller is safer when talking about HHO.
One other thought that just occurred to me now is if you used metal flashback/backfire arrestors (afew in series) and you grounded them perhaps it would force the EVO out of the gas line before it reached the generator and caused an explosion. Or maybe just ground your HHO torch. Just some ideas :)
Hey Bob,
Very sorry to hear about the accident involving Ohmasa's and the death of his co-worker. I have a very small HHO generator and during my research relating to flashback and backfire arrestors, I stumbled on a comment on youtube (unfortunately I can't find it now but I remember it was on a video from this channel https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZOPMqpMIcEloSwqleQcfeA). They were talking about systems to generate deuterium depleted water through burning browns gas and capturing the liquid. I would argue they are getting much more than just deuterium depleted water probably and don't even know it. Anyways the comment that caught my eye was warning about backfire arrestors and one person was saying to use 2 arrestors to be extra safe, and another person chimed in saying to be very careful doing it as he'de had 7 (yes seven) backfire arrestors in series and they had ALL failed at the same time. This brings me to your remark where you said something along the lines of "people always say it's a hydrogen explosion, but much more is taking place here" This would be in keeping with what I've read as you would expect if the probability of a single backflow arrestor failing due to explosion was relatively low, it would be very unlikely that SEVEN would faill at the same time, unless the effect was something else (an EVO shooting back up the gas line to ground through the generator perhaps?)
Also sorry for my lack of updates recently, my friend said he would record a vocal for the song but we haven't had time to do it yet as he's been busy. Also I did try the experiment with 0.2mm thick lead foil in a sealed plastic bag but it was not so successful. I tried stick 0.2mm adhesive lead foil onto aluminum foil and that appeared to generator afew tiny holes in the aluminum side but I haven't had a chance to put it under a microscope yet. It did give me an idea though based on space earth human which I may or may not try. Taking an adhesive backed lead foil and cutting it into say 20 squares and layering them on top of one another. We know that EVO's like to form in crevices, and we also know from space earth human that diffraction gratings can slow them down (at least I think that's what I remember reading). It seems like it might be a good way to build a kind of safe zone the evo might be more likely to stay in (without needing to make a full on nested set of boxes like a full on orgone accumulator type thing.
Lastly just a word of caution about drinking HHO infused water from an annecdotal experience :) I tried this recently for a health issue I was having and it seemed to work I think however it's hard to know. Anyways I had some issues when I mixed the HHO infused water with coconut water and consumed it, it was like I instantaneously got dizzy, quite amazing. I have a good friend who's been a homeopath for 30 years and talked to her because I wanted to know what the symptoms for the proving of coconuts involved. and the symptoms exhibited by the people sounded to match what I've been feeling the last few days. Anyways I realize it's annecdotal and entirely speculative but I'm left with the suspicion that the EVO's in the water picked up the energy from the coconut water, then gave me the equivalent of a hyper homeopathic dose of coconut water. Needless to say I've headed my friends recommendation and won't be consuming HHO water any more (especially not after mixing it with anything) ;)
7 arrestors, that all failed!
Hey Bob, Sorry I apologize I misremembered this, it was 5 arrestors of which 3 failed (I should have searched for the comment before remarking), I wrote a script to search all the comments on all the videos in that youtube channel and tracked down the actual comment I was misremembering.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKUx3yt66ho
The relevant portion of the comment was " I installed 5 safety systems to catch and arrest any such occurrence; however, in one such occurrence 3 of the 5 safeties failed/were defeated by the explosion. In short, not something I was willing to contend with further on a commercial level with 100s of L/minute of HHO gas. "
So I guess adding lots of backflow arrestors may be an option. Anyways it would seem that 3 isn't enough possibly.
The full comment is below for context (don't bother reading it though).
"Aquarion H2O
Aquarion H2O
5 months ago
@delvis11 The initial proof of convent for reducing HHO back into drinking water was disassembled about 2 years ago. I’m in process of completing my 3rd generation system now, with 5 generations of systems already designed.
The big benefit to the “new water” generation is the stripping out of Deuterium (heavy hydrogen isotope) from the water, which leaves you new “drinking water” that has many health benefits once processed for drinking.
The biggest downside of the reduction process from HHO to drinking water is the hydrogen bomb sitting there if/when your torch goes out.🥴. In my proof of concept system, I installed 5 safety systems to catch and arrest any such occurrence; however, in one such occurrence 3 of the 5 safeties failed/were defeated by the explosion. In short, not something I was willing to contend with further on a commercial level with 100s of L/minute of HHO gas. Any failure on that scale would be very very damaging & life-threatening....So, my advice, if you want to keep a system of this nature for your own personal use, over engineer your safeties & use a catalytic converter instead of a torch for your reduction phase. Ideally, also use PEMs so you don’t need to use electrolyte (because these add contaminants to the system which lead to other unwanted issues).
Cheers "
I think the grounding of the flame arrestors is a great idea but also use a bubble chamber type arrestor in series to the traditional type of porous metal arrestors for added safety. This stuff is deadly and very unforgiving of lapses in attention to safety.
Good point, can your recommend devices that work at pressure and allow very high flow rates for the BN 2000 device?
Not sure what is commercially available for high flow rates. I would imagine you would need to design and fabricate something based on the flow rate and pressure but with a burst disc in case the down stream arrestors failed. It will introduce a pressure drop as well that would have to be calculated into the system performance. I would suggest testing a scaled down version first then moving up or adding small modules in parallel to increase the flow rate as the bubble elements in these chamber type arrestors probably don't scale well and have a maximum safe flow rate before the bubbles become a stream.
What is the order of flow rate and pressure for this BN 2000?
I was only using a small gas generator with low pressures and flow rate when I built the "water bong" type secondary arrestor for my system years ago. The concept is simple but I always go with smaller is safer when talking about HHO.
One would think that a safety mechanism was included in the BN2000. Here are the specs.
http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/home/mfmp-blog/553-atomic-phoenix-brown-gas-generator-project
One other thought that just occurred to me now is if you used metal flashback/backfire arrestors (afew in series) and you grounded them perhaps it would force the EVO out of the gas line before it reached the generator and caused an explosion. Or maybe just ground your HHO torch. Just some ideas :)
Grounding would not hurt IMHO